I don't think you could pick two schools farther apart in general campus culture than CMU and WVU. You really need to narrow your focus.

I see what you're saying. It was in the back of my head but hearing someone else bring it up..I'll definitely think more about it.

I'm very happy you shared your story. Would you mind sharing what else you got involved in? I was thinking if I actually got into Carnegie for Computer Science my academics would keep me so busy and I'd be very interested in graduating with honors. My current small university mandates so many events..mandated things at carnegie subtracting from my study time might be too much for me to handle.

It is a national group however my University only has a group of intent. I can almost guarantee we'll reach provisional chapter by next semester and have high hopes for becoming an official chapter by the end of next year. I understand that if it was local the story would be different.

If anyone can clarify this: the national advisor is getting an official chapter to come down and perform an initiation ceremony..but we're only a group of intent. What exactly does getting pinned whilst in a group of intent mean? Is that a nationally recognized lifetime commitment or..?

MOST IMPORTANTLY, for transferring from a probably considered low-mid tier school to the likes of Mellon for Comp Sci you really don't think philanthropy matters that much? Of course I agree that grades are much more important but at the same time "not giving a rat's ass"..do you really believe that?

I understand the differences. Different doesn't always mean happy in one place and unhappy in other. To be perfectly honest, I know many people at WVU and the party culture there is superb while still maintaining solid academics. It'd have the opportunity for a balanced life while also being a school relatively easy for someone of my credentials to get into.

CMU has been regarded as highly prestigious to everyone I know for such a long time. I've heard it's name repeated since I was a kid. Not to mention US Newsweek or whatever that website is ranked it as #1 for computer science. No matter who does the list, it's consistently in top 10. It's location suits me best actually. While I like to think I'd really enjoy WVU culture I know that personally I'd prefer to be in a more secluded, dreary kind of area.

(as I understand CMU is stationed in a very windy, rainy, mellow-type place but still has a good bit of industrialization (aka businesses to keep locals/students busy/entertained))

Okay, I have a lot of thoughts. I chopped up your post so I could answer better.

Firstly, that's an extremely broad range of schools. Like 33girl said, you should narrow your focus. You're looking at schools around the country with completely different vibes.

Secondly, it concerns me as well that your concern is the nice big houses that you'll be attracted to. I went to a small private school, myself. I understand envying the large chapter houses other schools have, but that was in no way a deal breaker for me.

Thirdly, you're concerned about how busy your schedule is now that you're "in" a fraternity? Hi, welcome to Greek Life. You must realize that at a larger school, you'll be in organizations with a higher capacity to do more/larger events, right? You're going to be involved in philanthropy work, regardless.

And fourthly, I guess this is just for my own understanding, but how are you looking at schools with "no greek life?" You mentioned Michigan State, but MSU is a Big 10 school with a large Greek Life presence. There are Greeks on this site from MSU.

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So, just some final thoughts I'm having: if you're so interested in the fraternity you're pursuing (you like its motto, ideals, brotherhood, etc), why not check out one of the ~40 schools where the fraternity has a presence? In that case, the work you're doing for the colony won't be in vain. Plus, it'll really stand out to the guys at the new school.

Also, I know you're having doubts about your small school. Like I said, I understand. I went to a school with at most, 5,000 students, including graduate and nontraditional students, mostly commuters. They thing that really kept me there was my Fraternity and the Greek Life system. Greek Life was able to give me the social involvement I needed. Not to mention that being at a small school allowed me to make a lot of valuable connections and leave a deep, visible legacy in the organizations I was involved in.

So, while deciding if you're going to transfer or not (I see you said you're 99% sure, though), don't rule out everything that your small school has to offer.

Okay, I'm done.

Pick no more than five schools out of that exhaustive list. Prioritize based on your career goals at this time. Bear in mind your age and that you will likely change. THEN make a decision about the fraternity.

Had an hour long convo last night with a 22 year old (soon to be 23), who's almost a year out of undergraduate school. She made a decision to go with a Big Four accounting firm when she was a sophomore. She's looking at things very differently now. She said "how did I know what I was doing when I was 19? I am not the same person I was then." My point: you are going to change immensely in the next decade. Put your educational goals first.

I'm unsure about the "no greek life" thing as well. On collegeconfidential there is a search filter for schools without greek life, I didn't look into the accuracy of it though.

Subtracting schools I don't like (which is only like 4~ anyway) and liberal arts schools (7-10?) schools with chapters include:

Cornell University
Purdue University
Bucknell University
Virginia Tech
York College of Penn

I don't feel very strongly about any of them except MAYBE Virginia Tech but I was recently informed it's considered more of a technical school rather than a four year? I'm not sure. But Cornell? Probably not with my credentials. The rest? I just don't think they're for me. I'm transferring to pursue education and overall experience, not fraternity life specifically.

It's just like I said, if I did get into something like Carnegie, 20% of the school involved in greek life? I just can't help but think I'd feel a little excluded. On the other hand, if I got there i'd be so bogged down with academics I doubt i'd have time for greek life anyway..but I also don't want my like to be 100% academics, you know?

I understand what you're saying. I do plan to narrow the list, I still have a year to decide this is just a very broad preliminary thing.

I understand what you're saying about that age thing as well but unfortunately there's little way for me to predict what I'll want or what I'll wish I had done at this age when I'm 22. That's why i'm so stressed and panicking..I have to decide my future now. It's an odd concept if you think about it. A very nerve-wracking one. I think I'd be happy anywhere, even if I stayed here. The thing is, being happy by "making the best of it" and being at a literal "better place" are very different.



Also just to note, the fraternity house comment was serious. They are envious as it seems several of you can agree. But I didn't mean for it to be a deal breaker. I just think that having next to a mansion for your organization as well as 5-20x as many members all active would be a much more involved, err..complete feeling compared to 15 or so guys struggling to recruit 1-4 people per semester if not year doing events at the same selection of less than 15 local "philanthropy" locations (Schools, shelters, etc). Compared to having a lot more people with a lot more resources doing a much larger variety of things (as you even said, more money, more resources, more frequent and more diverse events).

>>Then stop relying on College Confidential (or GC or anyone else) to do all of the work for you.


>> Graduation, Retention and Transfer Rates:

First Year Student Retention (full-time students): 92%
4-Year Graduation Rate: 59%
6-Year Graduation Rate: 83%

>>Again, stop relying on other people to "inform you". Do your homework. (That means you can contact the schools themselves to ask questions. Use your phone, call them.)

Good luck, and as everyone has suggested, narrow down your choices. It's impossible and ridiculous to writing a novel on every particular issue that affects your final choice. We don't know you. Speak to your current advisor, your parents, trusted professors, educational counselors - they can help you figure this out. WE can only make suggestions based on very limited information, and that means anything we suggest won't answer your questions sufficiently, because we don't know the whole story.

Yes, I do believe that. The number one thing that admissions committees are concerned about is whether you can do the work and become a successful graduate. I know you're really busy looking at all the rankings...do you ever see a tech school publish the number of community service hours done by their students? No. They publish quartiles for SAT/ACT scores and GPA's. If you are a borderline acceptance, recommendations from your professors, activities related to your major, etc. may be helpful, and in fact, a major leadership position with quantifiable accomplishment may even get a second look, but nobody cares that you volunteered at the homeless shelter once/week.

CMU has a strong Greek system, but I never met anyone who felt excluded by not being Greek (I left many years ago, but stay in touch). In fact, there are a few organizations that are not greek, but exist to give students much the same collegiate experience.

Today started their BIG spring Greek event - Carnival. See the web cam at http://www.contrib.andrew.cmu.edu/~sc0v//webcam. In addition to Midway, there are reunions, socials, plays, concerts, etc.

I just have to say this: it's either "Carnegie Mellon" or "CMU." Calling it just Carnegie is nails on a chalkboard. You are going to be pretty much in the middle of Pittsburgh (well, east middle) and near many other colleges with many more women, so if that's going to be too much of a distraction for you, I'd think twice.

I say this with love. You have to go a LOOOONG way to feel excluded or freakish at CMU. :-)

Someone from the fraternity in question could best answer this question, but my guess, especially given use of the word "pinning," is that it's what is traditionally called "pledging." No lifetime commitment involved yet.

Bear in mind that many of us here at GC are not on college anymore. We're alums, and some have quite a bit of experience on the other side of things. DeltaBetaBaby works in academia.

I'd say you've been misinformed. You might want to step away from College Confidential.

If bigger sounds better to you, that's fine. Flavors of ice cream—some of us loved being in big chapters, some of us loved being in small chapters, and some of us thought the grass was greener on the other side of the fence. Some of us even come from GLOs that typically have small chapters, and we value what benefits that can provide.

But please understand there may not be a "mansion." At some very Greek schools, there may not even be a house at all, or it may be a house that only a small number live in.

Ditto to not relying on college confidential and GC, and waiting for people to inform you.

:) Good luck to the OP but I shudder when people seem to rely heavily on message board advice or expect people to inform them with minimal effort on their part. Use your college smarts and ability to research to find information beyond college confidential and GC.

GC must be having a boring week.

You have narrowed down your choices. Go visit the campuses. If they have a chapter of the fraternity you are a provisional member of, make arrangements to stop by the house, or get together with some of the brothers during your visit. Make a list of things you would want at your ideal school. See how the schools remaining on your list match up with your list. Is your list a little too far-reaching (meaning that no school would match up)? If so, adjust your expectations so that they are more realistic. Make a pros and cons list of the schools you are interested in. But do go visit.

I predict that the things you value so highly right now will seem a bit trivial in 10 or 15 years. This is not a test. You are not being graded. There is no right or wrong answer. You can make the best of it, no matter where you finish your education. You are stressing too much.