It's hard...
 

I tried my best to make my post as general as possible so as to not offend The ladies of Delta Sigma Theta, Its hard though because the discussion was brought forth by the recent action by their grand chapter.

I digress to another point:

It's hard to disagree with the point about the intial signing of the application. Making a stipulation on the contract stating that this agreement is legally binding and also property of XYZ, would make prospectives even more accountable for their actions. So in retrospect it seems legal to post their names if they breached a contract which in truth really happened. :D

I'm very sure that the ladies of Delta went over this list for any legal ramificatons. I as a interest knew about the Omega list. But because of past threads here, it seems we all know about the Delta list now.

:) I second that... just constructive dialouge here.

A prospectives opinion
 

I think a DAR and the AR&R report is a useful tool to those of us who want to come into any of the organizations the right way. It lets you know who to be weary of when pursuing membership.

Re: A prospectives opinion
 

Sorors and SF's - - I was thinking about this and, you know, a lot of this comes down to plain ole COMMON SENSE. Whether someone is on a DAR or not, if a member of XYZ comes up to you because they know you're interested and tells you to get down on your knees and recite XYZ's Founders and then tells you to show up at his/her house in 30 minutes and clean it until it's spotless - - - you're being HAZED. Use common sense. REMOVE YOURSELF FROM THAT SITUATION - QUICKLY. That person may not have made it to the DAR yet. The DAR is only the list of people who have been CAUGHT. Out of 150,000+ members of an org, I guarantee you that there are more than just 40-50 shady hazers out there. If you participate, both of you are in jeapardy.

Yesterday I mentioned in this thread that orgs need to first examine the purpose of publishing a DAR. If it's done in order to publicly embarass people and convince them to pay fines, then (well, I still don't think that publishing a DAR for the world to see is the way to do it). But if it's purpose is to alert prospectives to potential hazers, then common sense is the answer.

So, for any prospective, use common sense. This not only applies to questionable hazing activity, but it also applies to using the principles of discretion and asking members questions about events and membership intake. 9 times out of 10, you can probably answer the question yourself, and if you can't, the answer probably isn't for you to know in the first place. As a prospective, if you want to know whether the XYZ chapter at your school is active or suspended, contact the Student Activities office at your school. They can tell you. And you don't have to embarrass yourself by asking a member that question. Alternatively, call the national office of that org. They MAY tell you.

Re: we'll see...
 

i agree with Diva_56 i think posting non members is opening up a big ole can of worms. AKA nationals already has their own list/disciplinary report (nationals don't sleep) but they are not going to post that puppie for the entire world to see, its between AKA and those individuals. I think in the sorors only section we should have a list of sorors who have jeopardized the organization, however the bottom line is each to his own. i am happy with the stand AKA has taken and know that she will pratice discretion in her dealings with these individuals.

to the top

I think that some of the information should be for members only, such as members on suspension and probation. That has nothing to do with prospects UNLESS they have been suspended or placed on probation for hazing. This will alert prospects of persons that may approach them about membership when they are not even active. If they are just suspened, etc. for something that would not affect prospects, such as late with dues, etc., then that should be keep private. I feel that the chapter suspension and probations should be listed. That would cut down on confusion and specualtion. No prospect would have an excuse for participating in ANYTHING with a chapter that is not active. Although it is easy to walk into the Office of Greek Affairs (or whatever it is called on your respective campus) and find out about a chapter's status, some people regard this as going to question the Great Oz. It would be right at their fingertips.

As far as persons that have been blackballed, I am up in the air about that. It does seem like a huge embarrassment! However, if they have openly participated in hazing activities and got caught, then that is a consequence that they have to suffer. The hazing policy lists what will not be tolerated. You go against it, you get what's coming to you.

My Sorors.......
 

A Question for My SORORS...

So, now, after last week's tragic accident, have your feelings about having a DAR posted on our sorority's website changed?

I'll answer my own question...

No, my feelings have not changed. I don't think that it is appropriate...for Alpha Kappa Alpha...for post this information PUBLICLY...in the Members Only section...Yes.

Here's my reasoning: Any serious prospective who has taken the time out to research AKA's history and programs on the Internet..in my opinion..has access to view the sorority's page regarding hazing. Perhaps another option would be to also provide some "insight" to prospective members that let's them know that a graduate advisor will be present at all official functions. Perhaps some further information can be provided to guide prospective women as to how they may find out if a chapter on their campus is inactive or active. In my opinion, that is enough information.

Privacy
 

I haven't changed my position. There still should be a report, but it has to be password-protected and in the Members Only section.

Also, it's important for RDs and chapter basilei to have a written copy, too, because one may not always have a computer at hand.

Re: Why not?
 

naaaa. nothing has changed.

:)

Still feel the same...
 

Before this tragedy, I thought we should post the names of all violators of our hazing policy, both member and non-member. I feel the same way today. I'm not too concerned with protecting the image of "sorors" whose actions bring on shame, embarrassment and, in some instances, legal ramifications upon our sorority. I wonder if everybody who feels big and bold enough to engage in their "in the dark" behavior would do it if they KNEW it was going to be "brought to light."

I say, let's put their (members and non-members who violate our sorority's membership terms) biz out there, cuz their actions are putting our sorority on front street! And for those concerned that this isn't sisterly, how sisterly is it to put the entire membership in danger of shame and legal issues, all to please some need to belong?

There are sorors whose cars with AKA tags have been keyed and who have been literally called "murderers" by passerby in the street because of the incident in CA. Why? Because in some folks' minds, we were ALL (AKA) on the beach that night when those young women died, regardless of whether or not it turns out that in fact, the "sorors" associated with this situation were not even sorors, or suspended or expelled. If being on-line taught anyone anything, it should be that as one of us does, the rest of us go.

I'm 'with ya' Soror Disco...
 

As always...I agree 100% with Soror Disco!

I think the list should be made public accessible to anyone who wants to know who is active. That way, if someone is approached by an inactive soror offering to 'help' get them into the sorority, they can know that person is up to no good.

Hello all.... I can see why a list as such, completely available to the public would seem troubling, but I can say that I am sure the protection it provides to prospectives and in turn the organization as a whole is very important. Even if you would not like to put specific members on it, the chapter suspension and probation I think is key. It allows prospectives to know if the chapters at their schools are suspended or on probations, so anything that chapter is doing is illegal.

ttt
 

I changed my mind. Everyone should be able to see the list. Maiden names and married names included!!

Re: ttt
 

If I may ask, what made you change your mind, Ideal?