Anybody else get a MMITY vibe?

No, there would have been a racial slur or two in his post if it was MM

Just wait for it. He was going to say that immigration isn't the problem, it's the lazy n* that are.

Reforming immigration. That was a silly question.

Oh geez, there you went taking it seriously. It does depend, and I'm not really sure what I want to see done but it's somewhere between "Annexing Mexico" and "Kick the brown people out." So you know, I've got a range.




My first thought. My second was why even bother participating in the discussion if that's all you bring.

I didn't say I wanted amnesty.

We need immigration reform so people will stop whining about how illegal immigrants take all their jobs.

Um the only reason they undercut wages IS because they are here illegally. If they were legal, then they would be able to claim the same labor laws as everybody else.

Yes, but you are talking too separate issues. By your logic even if we didn't have illegals, we would still have the problem with people being payed illegally under the table. Though I don't think it would be as bad if we had a much lower amount of illegal immigrants. The only reason it is so common now is because they have so many people who quite frankly are open to victimization because of their status.

Are you worried that some illegal is going to steal your job super.fly? Get educated and trained in a skill that is viable and profitable. The "typical" border jumper has at most a 6th grade education and cannot speak English, so if he does take your job it must not have been anything worth crying over.

When you learn how to read what I actually wrote instead of making it up in your head, I'll actually reply to you.

Yeah the reason most people can't live off the grid and under the table is that they're trackable. The relatively few people who manage it are living under other identities (and thus still tracked, just not as themselves) or have removed themselves completely - paid in cash or in trade, either own their place outright or live with someone else, provide their own food or rely primarily on charity.

There's always the gray market but the "well employers will still cheat people even if they're legal" argument is a bad one.

Yep, I hear ya.

But, amnesty will make it more difficult (not impossible, more difficult) for shady employers (shady capitalists) to violate labor laws and cut costs. When people are no longer here illegally and are no longer running from the law, they are more empowered to fight for their rights across the board.

I feel a disturbance in the MMITY

That disturbance is getting stronger...

Didn't we try the amnesty thing before?

Until we're actually ready to enforce the laws on the books and properly guard the border, we shouldn't do anything.

If we can do those things, I think some sort of quick path to citizenship, or at least a low cost work permit program would be a better option. Until then, we all subsidize illegal immigration anyway through their drawing on our social services, criminal and civil justice systems, driving on our roads, etc.

Priority one, however, must be building a system where never again will there be an entire class of people who has to live in the shadows.

LOL. If it is madmax, I never had a problem with him. I always appreciated his larger points and ignored his ignorant points. :)

I don't like the term, " Doing jobs Americans won't do", because I don't feel like thts the case. I think they are getting paid wages that Americans can't survive on. I think if these so called unwanted jobs paid 11-13 dollars an hour you would see more US citizens applying for them. If we make everyone legal and give them the protection of labor laws and higher wages, who's to say the demand for migrant workers will be there anymore.