Thus the question mark at the end of my statement. I want her to clarify her position. Regardless, we still come back to the fact that it was 7:30pm and Trayvon was coming from the store going to his father's house who lived in that community. As far as we know it was raining. What's so suspicious about that??


Nope, not at all. I was basing that on her statement 'Point of the story, if you're walking through a neighborhood you shouldn't be in (like a gated one), with a hood up at night, you ARE going to look suspicious.' <---again his father lived in that community also, so how is it he 'shouldn't' be in that neighborhood?


BUT the fact is...too many young black men, regardless of their attire, time of day or night, have been wrongfully detained ( I can count off 3 incidents personally) and/or killed, WHY? Because they 'fit the description' or looked like they were going for a gun. This country has a long sad history of whites and non whites killing African American men and not being adequately punished.

Amadou Diallo - shot 41 times because of mistaken identity...unarmed

Sean Bell - shot because officers THOUGHT they heard him going for a gun

Abner Louima
Johnny Gammage


and so on...my point is, this happens entirely too much and if left to their own devices, Sanford would have swept this under the rug and it would have been another dead kid in the streets. The one thing I agree with PM Mama is if something looks wrong you call the cops and let them do their job! We don't get to determine who belongs where, if it doesn't look right call it in and let a professional make that call.

It may not look that simple to you but when it comes down to it, still, George would have been better served calling 911 and letting the cops handle it. Martin wasn't bothering him at all so why go after him?

COMMON SENSE:

If they aren't bothering you directly, why go look for trouble????


I got money that says that's probably what he was thinking while in his cell last night, "If I had let the cops handle it and stayed in the house, I wouldn't be in jail right now."

And actually as a small chuckle, I was thinking to myself....what are YOU doing up at 1:30am wondering why there are some teenagers wandering around at 1:30 am?? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

There will be an investigation and trial to determine this.

You will especially get flamed if you announce that you think you'll get flamed...but oh well. Let your words stand alone.

1 teen =/= group of teens. 1:30am =/= evening.

Is this the point where you try to convince us you're not racist because you know black people or something?

None of this illustrates that what Zimmerman did was right. But cool story, bro. Glad you didn't shoot those teenagers.

I didn't realize gated communities were high-class ghettos where the only people that are ever allowed in are the ones that live there. Is it really outside of your realm of understanding that Trayvon Martin was allowed to be in that neighborhood and it wouldn't be unreasonable for him to assume that he could walk to the convenience store and back without getting shot?

Is this the part of the story where you accuse people of being mean and shutting down your opinions? "I'm going to get flamed for this" - would you like me to call you a whambulance?

Listen - I'm fine with giving Zimmerman the benefit of the doubt and allowing the courts to decide whether he is or is not guilty. That's totally fine. But portraying the victim as "up to something" isn't helpful. Practice what you preach - you just shared a longass story that's completely irrelevant to prove your point that, what? You think he's innocent?

^^ wow. love.

"Hateful action" is not a hate crime. A hate crime is a crime that is motivated by hatred toward, and therefore targeting of, a particular group of people/member of a particular group of people.

This is not solely based on the offender and victim being of different demographic characteristics. It is not enough that Zimmerman is Latino (some categorize him as white Hispanic) and Martin is Black. There has to be evidence that Zimmerman was targeting suspects on the basis of race OR was profiling suspects as being "unfamiliar" or "not belonging" because they were nonwhite.

*****

There are many predominantly white (I assume this particular community is predominantly, someone correct me if I'm wrong) communities in this country where a nonwhite person is automatically questioned. This is more likely to happen in predominantly white neighborhoods because white neighborhoods are more likely to feel empowered and socially advantaged enough to be so vigilant (not vigilante). I have been "politely challenged" by white neighbors if my hair or style of dress is different than when the last time they saw me. I have also been challenged when visiting my parents' neighborhoods in which my parents have lived for 40+ years. "Are you here to see so-and-so." Would I get these challenges and questions if I was white--probably not unless I was a particularly suspicious looking white person. I am not a suspicious looking Black person unless whites have already mapped out the token nonwhites in their gated community and paid particular attention to prevent their community from getting too many "of those people."

I'm all for attentive neighbors and neighborwood watch. I'm not all for only paying attention when you see an "other" and taking it upon yourself to be the police.

What the hell does any of this have to do with the Trayvon Martin case? Please keep your commentary to that which is relevant.

I understand that. I am clear on the fact that this being called a 'hate crime' is not clear due to the evidence.

All I really want to see is that Florida gets this right and have enough evidence to make sure that the right sentence is passed and also the laws are closely examined so that someone else can safely walk down a street and not have to go through what both families are dealing with now.

And even though there are defined laws NOW that tells us what hate crimes are, it's still messed up how many people before James Byrd and others had to die before they were written...that's all.

Good.

There are a lot of people out there who have declared this a hate crime with no understanding of what a hate crime is.

If somehow this does get picked up by the feds as this being a hate crime, I wonder what else besides the recording and the supposed story about his warning others neighbors about black people they would have to go on.


Well, either way, I won't worry about that right now. I am just glad that step one has been done, he has been arrested and hopefully this will be done by this time next year.

I'd guess the feds would be looking at the racial breakdown percentages of the "suspects/incidents" GZ's reported to police, any patterns tending to show bias.

If this goes to trial, it may be interesting. Of course the evidence will show, but it'll be interesting to see Corey's motivations behind the 2nd degree murder charge, whether she really think's she can make that case or if it was more of a "hammer" to use in a plea offer if it goes that way.

Either way, I applaud Trayvon's parents, their discipline, dignity and show of faith in the face of this nightmare.

Where did I say it was ok to shoot someone because they fit a description? I never said it was ok for him to shoot AT ALL.

I've never heard that his father lived IN the gated community so that is my bad.


No it's the point where I say that I could care less what color or status or class someone is. If you look suspicious, I will be suspicious.

The whole point of gated communities is to keep out people who don't live there or have no connection to the place. I have honestly never seen any article that said his father lived in there.

Completely agree.

^^ You honestly have not seen ONE article saying that he was in that community because his father/father's GF lived there? That's been in nearly every article I've read.

I was 29 years old and had just gotten in. Should I have a curfew?

No from the articles I read it looked like he was taking a shortcut through the gated community, never that he lived in there. I admitted that I was wrong.

I never said that you did; I was merely re-emphasizing the point.


Yes it is as it's been in just about every news article that's discussed and still it's a bad judgement call to try and say who belongs where. Walking down a street is not suspicious. Walking down the street casing cars and homes, MIGHT BE.