Speak soror!...Speak! or PM me or something!

I just want to state for the record that I don't personally have a problem with anyone joining the org of their choice...no matter what it is. What bothers me is when someone says that they didn't feel that the NPHC orgs fit them when they did very little research (if any) regarding our orgs. Some people will come to this conclusion after their encounter with only one of our orgs or possibly because of hearsay, rumor, or bad press. If you are truly interested in gaining knowledge about us, then do some "real" research...on your own. I would respect a person more if they just said I chose ABC because I liked it...or because I wanted to...period...no explanation needed. There is no need to act like you did any extensive research that would lead you to conclude that the NPHC orgs were not for you. I'm one of those people who likes what I like and I don't feel a need to justify anything to anyone. But there are those that THINK they know what we're all about today because they've observed an undergrad chapter or two that didn't align with our missions or they heard this or that through the grapes. All I have to say to that is...we have a lot of undergrad and graduate chapters and a whole lot of members and I truly believe that MOST of us are doing great things in our communities, things that don't end up in the press and that people don't spread rumors about. If you want to do the research, then really do it and if you don't care to, that's okay to.

Hmm. All interesting points.

I'm gonna have to agree with whoever said the resources thingie. With the way our country is (ie lack of good public schools, bad support for the poor, etc.) I think if you take the NPHC orgs away, it would be a major blow to the Black community.

I'm not saying that that would happen by focusing on serving other communities as well, but it would split resources.

Now, there are other ways to help. As far as social programs and developing strong non-profits, the Black community is light years ahead of the Latino/a and Asian American communities.

One thing I would like to see is things like the NAACP, NPHC, etc helping solidfy things like NCLR, OCA, NALFO, NAPA, etc. because their advice would be crucial to helping build up those organizations and allowing them to strengthen their own communites. However, right now, there just isn't enoug communication between organizations to really build effective coalitions that truly address the hearts of the issues.

I mean, it's kind of a Catch 22. You need to help your own community because no one else will focus on it, yet when all the various communities focus on their own issues, it makes it harder to see the big picture at times and create coalitions that could possibly help one's own community and the communities of others.

Hahahaha, I could go on for HOURS about this topic, but I'm sure people are bored of my post by now! :D

I'm sorry, but I really don't follow where you are coming from. Not to be smart or anything...I'm just confused. What's wrong with saying that NPHC orgs don't fit you? I mean...there were only two facets through which to see any of those organizations as an outsider and that's 1) The National website, or press, etc. and 2) the local chapter...if there was one. I went to a school were there was only Zeta Phi Beta and Delta Sigma Theta (AKA was there...but inactive or not allowed to rush...something like that). DST was sort of familiar to me because some of my friends from HS pledged...but the DST chapter was not too visable at my school. I only saw them at general NPHC events...not with their own events. ZPB was more so....but still...it was only a few girls...maybe 7 active sorors. Being that the NPHC wasn't really jumping at my school...I would need to turn to the national history to see what they were all about...because I would feel I would be pledging something much bigger than what I see in front of me. But the history of NPHCs don't really feel like something I can align myself into. Besides, as a collegian, don't you have to pledge your school's chapter? So why research other chapters...unless you want to pledge as a alumna....or you're thinking about transferring? Even so, I think it would be tough if you truly desire to be in such-and-such org one day, but you decide to sit out 4 years because you aren't feeling your local chapter. I don't know...that's just me. Maybe it happens more often than I think.

Also, who researches anything if at first they don't find it interesting or befitting? That's sort of like calling out someone for not buying a certain car...because although it's fast and popular...your head bumps the ceiling when you sit in it.

I understand what you're saying but undergrad is only part of it. The real work begins after college, when you join a grad chapter. For most people, this will be their chapter for the rest of their lives and grad chapter is on a different level entirely. Some people have researched our orgs and fell in love with not only our history, but with what we are doing right now from a National perspective so they decided to charter a chapter if there wasn't one or wait and go grad. And like I said before...you don't have to do any research if you don't want to but don't act like you have...and I'm not talking to you specifically.

I joined AKA because of what I saw in AKA, not because of what I did not see in other organizations, and that is the only way that I would talk about my reasons for choosing my sorority. I would not frame my choice as a rejection of what I saw in other organizations, but as an embracing of what I saw in AKA.

I totally agree with you on this. That is exactly why I chose SGRho.

This still boggles my mind.

I could never imagine joining a "White Cultural Interest" fraternity (and no Sigma Nu is not always a "whitey frat", we're the minority at my chapter).

I honestly had thought that the Sesame Street Generation had gotten past all this stuff.

Whites tend not to express their interests as "white interests" because many whites don't think they have a race or ethnicity. "Whiteness" is invisible so they see their interests as "people interests" or "mainstream interests." When, in fact, their interests translate to "white cultural interest." This is why I go beyond the race-neutral jargon to get to what (white) people are really conveying.

I find the term "whitey frat" offensive. Was it used in this thread? Being the minority at a chapter doesn't mean anything.

Got past what stuff?

Wanting to be around people with the same interests who tend to look like them? Why would humans ever get past that? There's nothing inherently bad about it as long as it isn't based on inequality or perpetuates inequality.

Even people in multicultural organizations want to be around people with the same interests who tend to look like them. That's why most of them have friends, family, and acquaintances of the same race once they leave their multicultural chapter meetings and events.

This SHOULD be why someone chooses their org. We don't have to tear others down to lift ourselves (or our org of choice) up; doing so demonstrates lack of character.

First of all I wanna say I absolutely love the SoPi girls here, they're amazing. I'm actually attending the SoPi Unity Party up in LA this saturday night.

Anyways, seeing as how UCSD is 50% Asian, I think it's pretty obvious that the Asian-American community wanted to see some multicultural, specifically Asian Frats and Sororities. Politically correct, I guess they're called Asian-American "Interest" Fraternities and Sororities. We have Lambda Phi Epsilon, Pi Alpha Phi, and Psi Chi Omega representing the Asian frats and alpha Kappa Delta Phi, Kappa Zeta Phi, and Sigma Omicron Pi as the three Asian sororities on campus. Rho Delta Chi is a small multicultural sorority that is predominantly Asian, but isn't considered an Asian sorority. Beta Omega Phi is trying to colonize here from San Diego State University, but it seems like in the past few years Lambdas have tried to stop other Asian frats from colonizing...so we'll see how that goes. Asian frats just offer a family away from home that might be better suited for Asians.

Personally as an Asian and as a proud brother of Sigma Phi Epsilon, I feel that the family I have as an Ep is beyond comparison. It's just a matter of comfort, generally speaking most of my friends are Asian, and even that I didn't join an Asian frat. SigEp is historically known to be insanely diverse, I think our chapter is about 50% White, 30% Asian and 20% Latino so things are real good here.

Bottom line, it's all a preference.

You find "whitey frat" offensive? I do too, but all too often in my life I've been called "whitey" and "white boy" when I'm around minorities so I use it as a rhetorical device these days. Got past what stuff? Got past the self-segregation....culturally, politically, and residentially. It's totally ridiculous.

I guess the tables have turned. I would never dream of denying a bid based on race or culture....however I speak with great confidence in saying that I am 99% sure I would never get a bid in an NPHC fraternity no matter how many friends I had in the org and even if I did get a bid I would suffer so hard through pledging in order to make me quit. Sure I've heard of white people in Latina sororities or in black fraternities but it is FAR and FEW between. You claim that "general interest" is "white interest".....if that is so then why are there so many minorities in general interest fraternities and sororities?

Keeping in mind the OPs pov on MC GLOs, I would argue that being "XYZ "interest"" GLOs, they in fact are not multicultural. That is not to say that they do not have a multicultural membership (i.e. non-asians in the organization). Check back to the the OPs first few posts in this thread and you will see what I mean.

I'm going to need you to define "minority" and/or give me some NPC/IFC/NIC stats (if there are any-don't know if they keep said stats) to support the claim that there are "so many minorities in general interest" organizations.

This says a lot here about how uneducated you are about your own environment, race relations in America and in the world (past and present), and the history of sociological issues facing minority groups in the U.S. and in the world. Do you really not get that "general interest" is "white interest" in the U.S. especially? It really saddens me that we have so many college educated people in the U.S. and in the world, but many of them are not educated about issues that indirectly affect them and directly affect their fellow men and women. It's really mind boggling that your eyes could be so closed. Being sheltered and not growing up among those who are different from you is no excuse for being ignorant of the issues facing your fellow citizens...and this goes for the majority and minorities alike. Yes, you have some minorities who did not grow up in areas where their race or culture was dominant and so they too walk around with their eyes closed if they did not educate themselves. There is no excuse to be so blind. Even though you may not get certain information in school, from your textbooks, you can get it by opening your eyes, observing your environment (all of it), talking to different people, and in doing the research for yourself. And this is not an attack on you but hopefully it will be a wake up call to do some research and be more observant so that you can truly understand the world in which you live.

And yet people continue to spout ignorance. Double-consciousness is alive and well, no?

Just making sure you weren't like some whites who use such terms to seem cool and "down for the cause."

"Self-segregation" isn't an all inclusive phrase and isn't inherently bad. In fact, most forms of segregation aren't self-imposed but their harm is measured by outcome versus intent. What's the harmful outcome of the existence of BGLOs and MCGLOs? I don't see one.

But the fact that you thought people had stopped separating themselves makes me wonder what planet you just arrived from. :)


Not at all.

No, I don't. Most whites claim that.

Because many of these minorities believe that it just so happens that their GLOs were founded by whites and consist mainly of whites. So they've bought into the jibberjabber that whites are capable of controlling organizations without furthering whites' interests and reflecting "white culture." Therefore, at least within the confines of their organization, they believe there's no such thing as "white culture"/"white interests" aside from plain old people/mainstream/collegiate/Greek interests.

Whether they believe that jibberjabber when they aren't hanging out at the fraternity house is another story.

Fixed that for you. ;)

It's not a good idea to challenge people to see beyond their own standpoint of understanding while using male-centered language.

Thanks for the correction. I was once very sensitive to this.:)

unfortunately, this is the reality.

I was once very ignorant to it. Someone had to school me years ago. :)

What is sad, we talk about being Ethnic, but We as Greeks or the true Minoritys on Campus.:o

:confused: Do you mean Greek as in GLO or Greek as in "Hi, I am Paki from Cyprus?"

DAR!

Simple isn't it?

Oh me are you out there some where? What Planet are you from?:rolleyes:

Golly your funniness is, where ever you are. It is witisjisims I takle it?:o

There is a big difference in what you were were refering to and you have been on here long enough to realize that.
If do not understand this a Greek GLO Site for Social Greeks of Organizations then why even ask? GLO's!:)

1.) Joke!

B.) I still don't understand anything you are saying. Not a joke. :confused:

I hope you lose your wallet......soon.

psst: you can now use the IGNORE function on him. It's beautiful.

What is "White" culture?
What is "Black" culture?
What is "Latino" culture?
What is "Asian" culture?
What is "Native American" culture?

Is White culture growing up with only Italian food and language or growing up speaking English? Is Black culture Gullah or is it something else? Is Latino culture El Salvadorian or Cuban? Is Asian culture Indian or Chinese?

We make stereotypes and generalizations to ease the stress on our mind when we meet new people and place them in some "category" that we can easily define and that is comprehensible to the mind.

I am very proud of my Scottish, English, and French heritage, yet I don't use that as a reason to prevent myself from learning about other cultures and ideas. Everyone needs to open their minds a little bit. Step into someone else's shoes and view the situation from their POV.

Ok, I'm out. Graduation tomorrow and I need to get some sleep.

Pzzzzzzzzz,
Nate

Well, I'm sure you were being rhetorical and clever with this.

However, I challenge you to read up on this topic. You will find decades of research that will answer these questions for you.

This is why all categories exist. Gender, class, race, sexual orientation, etc.

Generalizations are based on observed social patterns across millions of people. That doesn't mean that everyone will fit in with the generalization.

But fitting into isn't necessarily a bad thing, unless the generalization is based on a stereotype (which has a negative connotation) and results in inequality.

Yep, I'm resurrecting it again. Whatcha got to say? :p It's for a good reason though. I happened back across this thread from another thread (using the links at the bottom of the screen) and I saw this post. Yeah, I know it's like three years old, but check this out:

http://www.sigmabetarho.com/home.html

I may have been in a cave for the last few years, but I could have sworn that this organization used to promote itself rather heavily as a South Asian fraternity. No offense intended in case anyone gets any ideas about my post. I had recently been talking about this new image and then just saw 33girl's old post.

I've posted here and there, but my life has gotten very busy. Glad to see you noticed!

You are ABSOLUTELY right. When I studied cultural and multicultural based GLOs more closely, Sigma Beta Rho was most certainly a SOUTH ASIAN FRATERNITY.

But look what I found here:

"One of my brothers is from El Salvador and another one is from Jamaica. Sigma Beta Rho was primarily South Asian to begin with but now the ideal has become to learn about other cultures. Even within the South Asian culture, there are so many diversities. I know other South Asian fraternities that have stayed predominantly Desi, but I think we're growing because we're not like that and we don't discriminate."


Sigma Beta Rho is the nation's largest South Asian fraternity with 1000 members and 30 colonies coast-to-coast.


Uhhhhh.... contradiction? Are you a South Asian Fraternity or are you a Multicultural Fraternity?


Would I sound ignorant if I started using the term NJGLO? Because seriously, that's what these orgs sound like to me -- seems like every GLO I've seen from New Jersey is multicultural in membership and they all look like each other. Yes, the girls all have the "wet n wavy" hair and the guys all look like the Gotti boys, regardless of their actual race. It is the damndest thing!

Okay, I busted out laughing at this. & yes I'm a (proud?) Jersey girl. All joking aside though, I think a lot of orgs (or chapters of orgs) in Jersey are diverse because the state itself is pretty diverse. So, no, I don't take your NJGLO as ignorant, it's a relatively accurate description (minus the looking alike part, lol, at least for my org anyway).

http://planetsmilies.net/ill-violate...miley-9436.gif

Bwahahahahaha! Where is Ch2tf? She needs to see this post. By the way, I love the edgy Rashid!!! LOL!

Te amo mi amor!
In some ways I don't think it is fair to say it is a NJGLO, but it is sorta accurate as well. Chapters of orgs are re-marketing themselves as multicultural to gain more members because the Greek population is small.

I think the problem with this whole re-marketing/"everyone" trying to be multicultural stems from several factors:

1. It's what's HOT right now! hahaha, j/k sorta. It's a way for more people to buy their product, and younger/smaller orgs are trying to get brand recognition. (Sorry for the business analogies, it's what is in my head right now)

2. Younger/Smaller orgs not expanding strategically and as a result after the founding class/line and maybe one or two additional classes/lines, the chapter is struggling for members and opens up to new markets. With respect to younger/smaller orgs, it is a lot easier for this trend to catch on within the organization, especially if they are experiencing low membership numbers across the board.

Its a rush to be one of the big guys (at least in number of chapters), without substantially investing time in doing research about the climate of the school, the commitment and dedication of interests, and being able to support your chapters as an organization.

Another problem is in expansion when interests really only have info from the org's representatives to go off of (sometimes because the org is small and sometimes because the interests are lazy and just want to be down/have letters). They might know someone from back home who joined ABC org and they think the "concept" is cool, but they have no idea what the organization is actually about and what they are doing (for members, communities, etc). In the case of MC orgs, you have organizations that say they are multicultural, but that operate almost entirely on a different platform, yet the interests do not spend time doing the research on the "product" that the "Sales Team" is selling. About a year ago I had someone say to me, if I had known about TNX before I joined my org, I would have def pursued TNX. I guess she was trying to complement us but to myself I'm thinking,"You Fool!". The internet has been on and poppin' for a good minute, there is NO way you couldn't have done a google search and found out about other mc sororities. And of course there's greek pages, wiki, but I digress.

In the case of NJ, I think it happens in part because many MC orgs have been founded there, and newer groups that are ethnically based may view the "success" that they have on campus as a way to gain a foothold in the market.

I just love the "We are X with multicultural membership schpeal [sp?]" It gives me a chuckle every time. To me I feel like it is obvious that there are internal identity dynamics going on in an organization when that happens. Trying to come at it from an interests perspective, I can't understand why you approach an organization with apprehension about joining the group because you may not be of the same ethinicity as the group majority. It's cool if a black girl wants to join LTA (just using them as an example not saying they are culprits of this) because she sees something in them she aspires to, or that she feels they are really holding it down. That doesn't make LTA a latina sorority with multicultural membership; it is a Latina sorority, period. They were founded as a latina org, they service the latino community. 1 black girl, 100 black girls, or a diverse chapter does not change that fact.

We (MC orgs) need a (strong and viable) council, like ASAP.

And that my friends is my rant of the day.

Generally speaking, I feel this might be more applicable to NIC members, but does it need to be "either/or"? I'm not sure I understand how it might be a contradiction when the two identities might be appropriate. Especially when an organization self identifies as such.

I think the difference is when an organization says "we are a {insert ethnicity here} organization" it means even thought the members don't all have to be that ethnicity, they are going to do activities and support philanthropies specifically geared to that ethnicity. Multicultural groups, I would guess, tend to "spread it around" a little more and not support one particular ethnicity (i.e. they are just as likely to volunteer at a benefit to help sickle cell victims as they are to put on a workshop about Asians in the media).

Sorry if those examples weren't the best, but I hope you got what I was trying to say.

I think that a member of a Multicultural GLO can better answer this.....but I will try.

It's basically like Migma Pambda Shamma being a Multicultural Sorority only situationally, and a Latina Sorority when it's convenient.

As has been defined on GC by MCGLO members, a Multicultural GLO is not the same as a GLO with a multicultural membership. If Sigma Beta Rho evolved into something else, then I think it needs to get away from being labeled South Asian.

Just my opinion.

ETA: Yeah, what 33girl said, too.

I agree with you and 33girl.

It reminds me of the observed increase of nonblack members in NPHC orgs over the years. That frightened some initially until it was realized that our founding principles and objectives don't change just because there are chapters where people of the African diaspora are in the minority.

It's the difference between description and purpose that is in question. An organization may have multicultural membership (most do). But, a "Multicultural Greek Letter Organization" is one whose sole or primary purpose is to promote multiculturalism, support social justice as it relates to multiculturalism, address life as a multicultural person/in a multicultural world, continue bringing discussion of multiculturalism to people's attention (what defines multiculturalism, how does one engage a multicultural world while maintaining his/her identity), etc.

Consider it this way: Would consider an NPC sorority with members who studied engineering to be an engineering sorority? Or is it a social NPC sorority?

Same with multicultural Greeks. We are about multiculturalism just as engineering Greeks are about engineering. The comparison isn't exact, but I hope you get the point.

Sigma Beta Rho began with the express purpose of addressing the needs of individuals from South Asian culture(s). They are now calling themselves multicultural because their membership is diversifying, not because their purpose has changed.

ETA: Y'all post too daggone fast for me.