I don't think anyone's saying who you personally identify with - there's no way any of us could possibly know that. However, in American society, people looking at you will identify you by race before they identify you by ethnicity. That's a fact. It's also a fact that the race they identify you with - white - grants you certain privileges in American society. It's not only a matter of the privileges you choose to exercise or reject, but also inherent privilege involved with being white and being a part of the majority which currently and historically has held the power in this country.

I think one thing that is important to remember, however, is that when ethnicity does become an issue with white people, it can often be perceived negatively. Especially in the case of Italian-Americans, who are often stereotyped and treated unfairly by the media. So I can see how this would be an important issue for you.

You said you identify with exactly what I said you identify with. Race-white; Ethnicity-Italian American. Problem? Better yet, read "How the Irish Became White" by Noel Ignatiev. Then you'd see that this topic isn't about YOU. ;)

No one said that.

Congratulations on finding something to be offended by. :) People can moan and groan all they want to just to prove a point in a thread but if a camera was to follow you around everyday of your life, you would see the truth for what it is.

Everyone should read this.

I agree.

But Italian Americans are still given the opportunity to either downplay or "up"play their Italian heritage. Either case they can identify as white and receive the same privileges as other whites in most social contexts. Italian Americans can even receive the utmost privilege in places with huge concentrations of Italian Americans.

You're being ridiculous. There is very little distinction in affirmative action as it is practiced today, and diversity seeking universities. Don't believe me? Go look at the UM Supreme Court cases portrayed in the media as "affirmative action cases."

How is reverse discrimination audacious? The fact that you refuse to recognize it is pretty outrageous in my mind. What you're telling me is that its ok for a university to accept a black candidate over an equally qualified white person simply because they're black. You're right, thats not reverse discrimination at all...

As for "leveling the playing field," you'll have to look other places. White people aren't holding the black community down. I highly suspect your blaming of the problems on institutionalized racism aren't aiding the rise of the black community either.

Again, about me "implying" that all minorities are only in school in place of white people, I never even came close to saying that. Try as you might, me saying that it HAS happened is in no way similar to me saying it ALWAYS happens. I figured you two would understand that, but perhaps my confidence has been misplaced.

I'm not offended. I said I think it's dumb.

I know it's not all about "ME." But us wops have feelings too. Ethnic groups haven't exactly chosen when they get to integrate into mainstream American culture.

Saying things like "they can identify as white" and thus recieve white priviliges implies that it is a choice. I don't identify as "white" White means nothing to me. I identify as Italian and as American. My children will likely identify as German and Italian or as just plain American. American does not equal white it means that I feel attached to the country I was born in.

/And that I like Americanized versions of other countries' foods.
//I'd still be a wop in some eyes.

Good. :)

Exactly.

Then we agree. :p

You're leaping again. If I didn't type it, don't assume it. I always say exactly what I mean and mean exactly what I say because I know I'm not typing to my colleagues. ;)

Well don't get snippy because it's not that serious. You leaped without explaining your leap. So we were left to fill in the blanks and make sense of your leap. Surely you know that your posts have never warranted a benefit of the doubt before.

me too. usually the kids who fell at the back of the bell curve.

I am so confused...

Why am not amazed at little pledges from the University of Georgia showing naked women who happen to be of Afrikan descent to the public driving down the street?

shinerbock-

You know you ain't got no Black friends anyway, so what's up with the vehemenence? Sistahgirl DSTChaos just called your bluff and you need to be a man about it...

What's going to happen is you are gonna go off into a "hissy fit", "huff and puff", yell at all your little friends about Black people in Dekalb County, Stone Mountain, Georgia, where my cop, brother in law might have to take you to lockdown, 'cuz you missed your Klan rally up at the top of Stone Mountain...

If you want to hate baby, that's okay... You ain't got no game or skillz, but you can hate...

Which is probably the whole point to this pointless act. It just goes to show you that the Chi Phi pledges at UGA have no game or skillz and they have to show naked ladies to folks driving down to street to get some...

Now I'm confused. :confused:

You know I went to your undergrad as a grad student right?

And you're right, it definately has some characters...but there are some great folks there too.

Wow, I can't believe that you all actually had classmates that told you that crap to your face. :eek:

Maybe you should speak proper English if you are going to try to insult him.

Seriously AKA, I have no idea what you're talking about. If you're referring to your friend attempting to justify reverse racism, then thats fine, but I'm not quite sure.
I'm not sure what you mean by "my leap," so I can't fully answer your question. As far as I'm concerned, there is no "leap" involved. Its simply that you believe a black student should get into a school before an equally qualified white person, simply because of race.

As for affirmative action, theres no use debating what it is and what it isn't. I apologize if I don't recognize your definition over the likes of CNN or MSNBC...while I give you credit for being at least marginally intelligent, I'm not sure my regard can be extended that far. I think our fundamental difference in ideology is that while I think applicants should be admitted on merit, you feel some people should be given preferential treatment. I guess we're just different.

Starang, I find your comments regarding the bell curve funny...especially since the comment you are agreeing with was a completely erroneous assumption.