Posting restrictions coming to a GLO near you?

Dionysus · #1 11-12-2002, 09:47 AM

Particularly for you social greeks, do think this can become a trend?

http://greekchat.com/gcforums/showth...threadid=26140

IowaHawkeye · #2 11-12-2002, 09:56 AM

the minute someone tries limiting my free speech, and my ability to say what i think, is the minute i say "uh uh - no way not gonna happen..."

i'd post without my affiliation attached, but i wouldn't just stop posting b/c someone said so.

RedRoseSAI · #3 11-12-2002, 10:37 AM

If that's true, then it's a real shame. Let me explain why...

My college didn't have the greatest Greek life. My impression of NPC and IFC was, shall we say, less than favorable. It disappointed me, because I wanted to join in NPC rush, but then saw it wasn't for me. The Greeks on my campus, unfortunately, lived up to a lot of stereotypes.

Greek Chat helped change my perceptions.

I've found Kappas who are intelligent, DGs who are considerate, TKEs who are well-read, AKAs who are insightful, and on and on and on (insert your GLO into any of the above - there's been at least one person from nearly all the NPC/IFC/NPHC GLOs who has impressed me). In short, the great people on GC are wonderful ambassadors for their organizations. This board is unlike any other (anyone remember Greeksource.com? No intelligent discussion there) in its comraderie and support. Silence the Kappas, and that begins to crumble. We need to hear ALL the voices speak!

Kevin · #4 11-12-2002, 10:40 AM

It would really be a slap in the face. It would be like HQ telling their undergrads that they did not trust us to represent our letters and our values. Fortunately, in Sigma Nu the rules-making body is the bi-annual assembly of undergrads.

So I don't think that'd happen

CarolinaDG · #5 11-12-2002, 11:24 AM

I wonder if they had a Kappa moderate the discussion, if they'd allow it again? I understand that it's really hard to police the sisters and if they say something that's making the sorority look bad, than that can cause problems, but it seems to me that a simple solution is to just have someone checking the boards to make sure none of that is going on.

adduncan · #6 11-12-2002, 11:28 AM

I think there should be a way for GC to present themselves as a great "front door" to PNMs and a means of promoting Greek life. This is a wonderful group of people and a valuable display of the conscientiousness and brootherhood that Greek life is supposed to be about! In this day when many Greeks are having a hard time bringing in new members, the *last* thing anyone should do is cut off avenues of communication. Heck, GC is the reason I'm trying for alumna initiation in the first place!

I hope the nationals think long and hard about whether they can afford to cut off good PR. This isn't exactly MTV here.....

Adrienne

adduncan · #7 11-12-2002, 12:18 PM

My old Alma Mater Fishwrapper, the BU Daily Free Press evidently printed a cartoon taking a potshot at the Gamma Phi Beta chapter.
I haven't seen it, but the responses from the ladies that were printed were very classy.

The same people who print this paper are the ones who print editorials calling for dialogue and tolerance with all people in order to understand our differences. Except for Greeks, of course.

If any national prohibits their members from discussing the benefits of Greek life, they won't be able to stem the tide of derogatory comments from those who just don't "get it."

Here's one of the replies (the better of the two, IMHO)

http://www.dailyfreepress.com/news/321247.html

Adrienne

LPIDelta · #8 11-12-2002, 01:29 PM

I believe inter/national sororities have no intention of limiting people's free speech or the right to say what they want-- but I also know that there are times when members on this board (with names that clearly indicate what group they are a member of) will post things which are contrary to inter/national organization policy. *This seems particularly true when talking about hazing and risk management* This is an open board that anyone can read (including press, PNMs, parents etc.) and so perceptions can be changed both for the positive and negative.

If, as Greeks, we could monitor ourselves and actively work to protect the image of Greek organizations everywhere (and for me, that means only posting positive messages that are reflective of my international organization's policies--regardless of whether I agree with them) then the actions allegedly taken by Kappa Kappa Gamma might not be necessary. I know these public boards were going to be under discussion at the NPC biennial meeting and suspect this may have come from those discussions.

lifesaver · #9 11-12-2002, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RedRoseSAI
If that's true, then it's a real shame. Let me explain why...

My college didn't have the greatest Greek life. My impression of NPC and IFC was, shall we say, less than favorable. It disappointed me, because I wanted to join in NPC rush, but then saw it wasn't for me. The Greeks on my campus, unfortunately, lived up to a lot of stereotypes.

Greek Chat helped change my perceptions.

I've found Kappas who are intelligent, DGs who are considerate, TKEs who are well-read, AKAs who are insightful, and on and on and on (insert your GLO into any of the above - there's been at least one person from nearly all the NPC/IFC/NPHC GLOs who has impressed me). In short, the great people on GC are wonderful ambassadors for their organizations. This board is unlike any other (anyone remember Greeksource.com? No intelligent discussion there) in its comraderie and support. Silence the Kappas, and that begins to crumble. We need to hear ALL the voices speak!

*lifesaver stands to applaud RRSAI*
Well said!

We do need to hear all the voices speak.

BTW- Another Greek Source Refugee, lol.

CC1GC · #10 11-12-2002, 01:44 PM

Excellent points listed all around...what nat'l hq's don't understand is that the majority of information exchanged are solutions; to problems from an individual that couldn't find the answer on their campus, to lessons learned from reading another's mistake, or simply educating oneself on the culture of another greek-lettered-organization. All of these contribute to a stronger individual understanding of the system. And until each individual GLO can offer a service capable of providing this forum of ideas, they should retract their stance on this issue.

hoosier · #11 11-12-2002, 01:59 PM

KKG Natl.:

kkghq@kappa.org

Lil' Hannah · #12 11-12-2002, 02:02 PM

I have a feeling that Kappa's decision to stop members from posting may not necessarily have to do with opinions posted on Greek Chat, but perhaps message boards that *ahem* divulge secrets of various GLOs. It may be a blanket policy to avoid members posting on such questionable message boards.

adduncan · #13 11-12-2002, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lil' Hannah
I have a feeling that Kappa's decision to stop members from posting may not necessarily have to do with opinions posted on Greek Chat, but perhaps message boards that *ahem* divulge secrets of various GLOs. It may be a blanket policy to avoid members posting on such questionable message boards.

Excellent point re: boards and websites that spill secrets. I accidentally ran across one and was *really* appalled that something so private would be posted like so much laundry.

However: it only takes about 30 minutes of perusing this site to realize that's not the case here. Maybe it wouldn't be such a bad idea for KKG nationals to just "lurk" for a while and see how things go.

I just hate the thought of seeing a gag order clamp down on some really good exchanges that could help everyone, collegiates, alumni, and PNMs.

Adrienne

Eupolis · #14 11-12-2002, 02:56 PM

This is all second-hand, since I'm in no way a Kappa. I just know a bunch. Nothing gives me any special entitlement to comment on this. But KappaKittyCat is a good friend of mine, so I've got a few opinions.

From what I heard, it was a traveling consultant ('TC') who informed KKC of their headquarters' intent to restrict members from posting. Apparently they've been following GC, because the TC was able to figure out who KKC was. "Hey, do you post on GreekChat? Are you KappaKittyCat?"

I'm told by others that there were already rules in place that prohibited members of Kappa from speaking publicly on GLO matters while identifying themselves as Kappas. This is an extension of that kind of rule into the internet sphere.

There are reasons to have that kind of rule in some environments -- for example, in a lot of cases legal obligations can arise when a member (especially an executive officer) purports to speak for the chapter. Other times, they simply might want to make sure chapters speak with a unified voice for PR purposes, and one way to do that is by limiting who can speak publicly about Kappa. People, especially non-Greeks, will often assume that officers speak for their entire chapters. And, of course, there's always the goal of preventing embarassment, because, let's be honest -- we all do and say silly things sometimes. One person said to me, "Think of it this way. I can probably be quoted in the school newspaper as saying something about Greek life as 'L---,' but I can't be quoted in the paper saying that as 'L---, a Kappa.'"

Heck, maybe it was even against the rule for her to tell me that. How sad that would be.

Heather17 above pointed out an example of the sort of thing GLO headquarters would frown on: members who publicly dispute national risk management and hazing prevention rules. I don't think I've seen it from any of the Kappas -- the Kappas I've talked to have been fierce about risk management and hazing prevention. However, I've seen comments favoring more, ahem, "old fashioned" ideas of Greek life from members of my own fraternity, and I have to say it's bothered me.

I don't think that many fewer Kappas are going to post here. I just think that some active members are going to be anonymous about their affiliation and maybe avoid their GLO-specific board. I still think that's sad.

In law, we often say that the solution to 'bad' speech isn't to restrict speech, but to encourage more speech to counteract it. However, GLOs are very sensitive because they know that every event that supports a negative stereotype gets valued ten or twenty times more than events that counteract negative stereotypes. Besides, we're not working with law here -- GLOs are legally free to restrict the speech of their members. That doesn't mean that it's good policy.

I think that the existence of GreekChat, a community that is generally positive and supportive, that celebrates Greek life, and that is strongly panhellenic/interfraternal, demands careful rethinking of how far restrictions on member speech should go. I think that if they're going to restrict member speech, they're going to need guidelines that capture the complexity of this sort of thing and that let their members (and ultimately the entire organization) draw upon the benefits of this kind of forum. Yes, there may be some risks involved; right now, though, it sounds like they're cutting themselves off entirely from what can be a very good thing.

33girl · #15 11-12-2002, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lil' Hannah
I have a feeling that Kappa's decision to stop members from posting may not necessarily have to do with opinions posted on Greek Chat, but perhaps message boards that *ahem* divulge secrets of various GLOs.

Well, if KKG doesn't want its members posting on www.theboardthatdarenotspeakitsname.com, then just, well, speak its name and say don't post there. Plus, I could post on "that board" as Bill Gates and no one would stop me. It's kind of like saying don't go to any restaurant to avoid the ones with roaches in the kitchen.

I agree with CC1GC. I think we all help each other on here in ways we might not be able to if all we heard from or interacted with was our own GLO.